continuous bidding

There actually are more than this. There is something wrong with the process when houses come up short and have to COB while girls don't make it into a house.

Everyone says the system works, but I don't think it did at all this year. I know many girls were heartbroken when they were cut, and then those same houses are doing informal because they didn't fill their pledge classes. With the exception of a few top houses, I think most of the middle tier are pretty interchangeable and make far too many cuts because they have an inflated opinion of themselves. The proof is that while they were being overly selective they wound up not giving some really outstanding girls another look. There has to be a better way because I think the majority of the women going through recruitment would be an asset to any house.

It is my understanding that PHA decides how many girls are cut from each chapter each round based on return rates.. is that not the case? I’d be curious to see how many girls drop out of recruitment and how many are cut because of grades (though this would be hard to tell).

Yes, the process is called RFM (Release Figures Management). To really oversimplify, the sororities wanted by the most people are the ones who have to cut the most. This way the PNMs can focus on the groups where they have the best chance of receiving a bid. It may seem cruel to be cut early and heavily, but better that than for the sorority to string tons of girls along that they have no intention of bidding, just so they can brag about their return rates and overflowing parties.

That's how RFM works, but this time around many PNMs seemed to think they were better than the houses they were asked back to and so they dropped. My guess is that the RFM numbers need to be tweaked a bit because so many mid-tier and bottom-tier houses now have to go through COBing to fill their pledge classes. What's most troubling of all is that many, many legacies were cut who would have chosen their legacy house if they had the chance.

So only top houses are allowed inflated egos & can cut whoever they chose. Mid tiers should be thrilled to take the pnm’s the top houses released ? Give me a break. This happens every year, girls go through thinking the top houses will all want them. They focus on the 2-3 houses & it’s obvious to the other houses that they are not that interested. Then for a variety of reasons they are released from the top houses. Every house has girls that really wanted to be somewhere else. Sometimes they adjust, sometimes they drop. Maybe the mid tiers wanted the girls that wanted their house all week. Imagine that, sounds like the kind of sisterhood every house is striving to achieve.

I really don't understand your point^

@Correct
“this time around many PNMs seemed to think they were better than the houses they were asked back to and so they dropped.”

I agree with you that it sounds like RFM should be adjusted but this is more so a PNM problem than it is a sorority/recruitment/PHA problem. PNMs thinking they are too good for a house has been an age-old problem. If more PNMs are thinking they are too good for the houses they have left, it sounds like they have inflated egos.


@Huh
I’m pretty sure that @Jane means that not all PNMs see the houses the same. Some do not follow the hive-mind, and while I agree that some people are looking for the best sisterhood and give lower tiers a chance, I also think that trends are there for a reason. And that’s why as @Jane said, EVERY house has girls who originally wanted to be in a different house.

But houses also notice when girls drop. That’s why when there is COB houses can be more likely to pass on PNMs that rejected them in the past. Why invite a girl to COB of she didn’t want us in the past?

Thanks @Jane for attempting to clarify your confounding original post. But if you are saying women going through rush shouldn't aim high and have a little pride, well, I disagree with you. There are some people who settle, and some who don't. Going in to rush had my eye on 6 specific houses, all of which have strict grade cuts and are known for being selective. I was dropped by two of them, but on the last two days I wound up with quality houses where I felt extremely comfortable. On my last day I had two of the original six to choose from and couldn't be happier with the results. By the time you go off to college you should know a little bit about yourself and what's acceptable. I think recruitment was just the first of many decisions I will make a long the way that will ultimately help me become the best version of myself. It's a process, but it's not an RFM problem when women make a decision about what's acceptable to them and what isn't. It's extremely personal, and I always knew that not being part of sorority life was an option I could live with.

"middle tier inflated ego" cough cough looking at you ADPi and AXO

What are you talking about? Those two mid-tier houses have strong identities and are far more selective than most other mid-tier houses. But unlike some houses, I saw no evidence during rush of inflated egos. these girls were very approachable and enthusiastic. In fact, I had some of the best conversations at both of them. You might not like a house, but let's not make unfair generalizations about them. It just exposes your ignorance and, let's remember, not every house is perfect for every PNM. People look for different things in a house and that's their right. But to point the finger at these two fine houses does a disservice.

I’d say pnms dropping because they think they are too good for a chapter is totally a thing. I was a pi chi, and talked multiple girls out of dropping because they only had chapters “they just can’t see themselves in” (often times the chapters perceived as “lower tier” on here) left. The ones that decided to stick out, ended up really happy with their chapters in the end. These girls are mostly coming straight from high school, where popularity and social hierarchy seem like a big deal. Its no wonder they still think this way during recruitment. That’s why what is said on this website, what actives say to their younger friends, and what pnms tell each other matters.

I think that if they just can't see themselves in a house, they should drop out of rush. But I don't think that means they think they are too good for a house. I felt the same way about choosing a college. I also had Wisconsin, Ohio State, Vanderbilt and Georgia Tech on my short list and was accepted everywhere. I had visited all of the campuses and we went back to visit again. What it came down to was whether I could "see myself there." Luckily my parents understood and now I am thrilled to be here because it's the right fit for me. And I certainly don't feel as if I was better than those other schools. Let's not be too critical of girls who dropped. Maybe they just know themselves really well and made the choice that was right for them. Who are we to judge?

@Well that’s totally valid, and I agree a lot of girls feel this way, but I do think some don’t. I think you can tell who is being genuine about seeing themselves somewhere and who isn’t when talking to them. Girls don’t wanna bad mouth a chapter to your face and that’s a thing to say to get around doing that. But also, pnms can only know so much about a chapter after meeting a couple people and so I think rumors and rent talk really impacts people’s perspective. If you go into a chapter thinking “my older friends say this chapter is weird and I’m not weird this isn’t for me” it’s going to impact your experience.

If girls don't see themselves in certain houses (and they're all lower ones) you can be pretty sure that they are stuck on themselves, not just "aiming high."

In fact, they should be aiming to find girls that they like, not girls that represent their aspirations.

Maybe they can't see themselves in a house because they really don't relate to weird girls.

Don’t get me wrong kappa is nice, but that isn’t the only great place you could end up. So many girls would fit in and have a good experience at many houses. You went through recruitment because you knew you would like sorority life. Don’t let one heartbreak get you. A good amount of chapters are doing COB, so shoot your shot and see what happens? Also there is spring COB as well, and which I know kappa participated in this past spring (but to be fair every chapter did this past spring bc 2018 rush was lower participation...). I’m sure you’re awesome and many places would have loved to take you. Allow yourself to have a chance. And if sorority life ends up. It being for you i’m Sure you’ll still thrive

There are so many houses that are similar to Kappa that you probably could have been happy at any one of the other mid-tier houses. Dropping was not a very smart thing to do. Sorority life may or may not be for you, but the only way you will know is to give every house a chance, either through COBing or recruitment next year. Everyone makes mistakes. But you can learn from yours. (BTW: lots of girls go through rush with GPAs higher than 4.0 and are AP Scholars. They also have had leadership positions and have gone to state athletically or have won Midwest music competitions. Your mistake may have been that you thought you were better than everyone else and that you were a shoo-in. Now you know better.)

I think a lot of women are stunned at just how competitive rush is. They think they will sail through and don't give all the houses a chance. Then, when they are disappointed at the reality of it all, they drop. that's OK. There is a big difference between someone who wants to be a part of sorority life and someone who just wants to wear prestigious letters.

Without RFM every house could keep as many girls as they want and string along hundreds that have no chance of being selected. Meanwhile, PNMs drop other houses that would have been a great fit. When they finally get cut at the last minute they are left with nothing. That's the whole point of RFM; PNMs take a second look at perfectly great houses that weren't originally on their radar. Just because a house is great at recruiting doesn't mean it's the best fit for everyone. Many PNMs end up happier in the end because their options were narrowed down early enough for them to get to know other houses and realize that the house where they ended up kept asking them back not because they were leftovers, but because they were actually wanted!

First of all, to the girl who said every house could string along hundreds of girls who have no chance of being selected, do you even go here? Do you even understand recruitment? Many houses make huge cuts after the first round because their nationals insist on making strict grade cuts, so they aren't stringing everyone along. Also, every round has fewer houses, so if you are just stringing people along how in the world would you fit them all in your house on the days when there are just two parties? The point is the RFM system is broken and has to be fixed. Times have changed and so have demographics. There is no reason that someone who wants to be part of the system and played by the rules winds up empty on bid day. And, yes, that truly happened.

PahHell makes it very clear that there is a price difference between Greek life and not. Just as with so many things in life, if you can't afford it, you shouldn't do it. This is a weak excuse.

Your are right!! The Panhellenic office on each campus need to update their website yearly to reflect actual cost of joining a sorority. Too many times these costs are not discussed until after bid day; which is unfair a not only to the girl, but also to the sorority as well. Transparency should be the priority!

Coco - there are HUGE disparities among houses and what their dues/house fees actually are. Those with new houses definitely have higher fees than other houses.

^That's just wrong. Just as we encourage PNMs to give every house a chance, we need to make sure we give all PNMs a chance, and that means seeing them more than once. I understand that the top houses have to make the greatest number of cuts because numerically everyone wants to go back there. But to cut it down to 2 after the first round? The system was NOT FAIR to this girl. It has to be revised.

Honestly what do you suggest? tbh I feel bad if anyone is cut so don't get me wrong. But one chapter doesn't know how another votes so they have no idea if a girl they cut is left with 7, 2 or 0 houses. If someone is down to 1 or 2 early on what are you saying should be done to fix it? Tell every chapter to invite 95% back to make sure everyone still has a full list? If someone is left with the same 2 for pref that they would have had on day 3, what did you gain. I just don't know what you mean by fixing it.

It’s really impossible to ensure the majority of the girls are going to have the opportunity to actually choose if they want a top house or a lower house. Top houses can only have so many members, and they are only going to take the girls they like. So if a top house doesn’t choose you then that’s the end of that. Giving girls another “shot” at houses that they realistically don’t have a chance of getting into isn’t helping them or the houses. It’s for sure not going to help the lower houses. If everyone was allowed to just pick what houses they wanted to go to everyday then cob would end up being another full on recruitment with all the houses that were overlooked by the pnms because they thought they were too good for them during formal. The current process works in a way so that PNMS are aware of all of their realistic options. It gives PNMs a chance to get to know the houses they actually have shot at instead having a ton of girls waste their time and energy focusing on pursing a top house that doesn’t even want them. A ton of girls would be cut if they had the choice to keep pursing a house that wasn’t really interested them and a ton of sororities wouldn’t make quota. It’s not good for the PNMs or the Greek system and just drags on an already exhausting process.

Obviously some sort of RFM needs to exist, but just as with any computer-generated process, it can be tweaked. Plus there is NO REASON quota has to be the same for every house. Why not use it as a baseline and then allow houses that need more women to fill have a higher quota? That way you don't go through the ridiculous dance of cutting girls only to ask them back again. That serves no one. Girls feel rejected, sororities feel uncertain and the whole system looks unnecessarily harsh. Clearly changes need to be made.